ethans_momma06
We Don't Owe You Sex
March 23, 2013 at 11:19 AM

I've been reading so many downright disgusting comments about women and rape now that it has once again made international headlines (India, Ohio, etc. etc.)

I wrote up a blog expressing some thoughts, but here was a key point that I wanted to discuss-

"

People, so many people- are jumping at the bit, justifying rape at the expense of the victim.

She didn’t say no soon enough. She was a tease. She dressed a certain way. She hung out in the wrong venue. She put herself in a bad position (drinking, drugs).

Here’s the thing I’m hearing here:

Women are walking around, available to screw any time a guy wants to. UNLESS she says no."

Do you agree with that conclusion? That some people seem to think that sex is okay-expected- unless they object (soon enough), vs. sex isn't expected, deserved, etc UNLESS she consents? What do you feel is causing statements like the above examples to be made?

Replies

  • ReadWriteLuv
    March 23, 2013 at 12:05 PM

    jaw drop

    Quoting jehosoba84:

      Absolutely not. But the way women dress these days...Don't you see that you're inviting the wrong kind of attention? And don't women have any sort of self-preservation, getting drunk/high/etc with people they don't know? Where is their sense of personal responsiblity? No, it does not mean that they 'deserve' it. But they are asking for it. I speak from personal experience in this matter. 

  • jehosoba84
    March 23, 2013 at 12:06 PM

     

    Quoting FromAtoZ:


    Quoting jehosoba84:

     Maybe my thinking is a product of the society I live in.   But if I go out, dressed like a skank, get drunk among strangers.... I really shouldn't be surprised if I get taken advantage of. By that.. I don't mean forcible rape. I mean he's drunk, and I'm drunk. Things happen that I didn't want to happen. According to law, that is rape.   

     In my opinion, a woman can dress very classy/sexy without baring breasts and wearing mini skirts. That kind of clothing send a very clear message. Men are visually oriented, we all know this. So why do we as women dress the way we do (leaving nothing to the imagination) and then act all surprised when we get 'unwanted' attention from it?

    I understand what you are saying.  But no man should 'assume' any woman, regardless of her outfit or otherwise, is all for having sex.......unless she tells him so with her words and nothing else.  I'm really trying to explain my thoughts on this without making it seem like I'm just making excuses for men. But you say she must tell him so with words. Women are much more verbal than men. they are more visual creatures. In *his* mind she has already told him she would be open to sex by the way she dressed and acted. Can you really blame him to thinking so? So to me, it's not 'unless she tells him so with words' it's more like 'unless she tells him no with words.'   Did that make sense?

    Recently, I was out with a few people, different ages, the youngest being 21.  She was dancing with friends, by way of doing nothing more than bending over and shaking her ass.  All the while her boobs were hanging out of her top.

    Some guy comes up behind her, on the dance floor.  She does not stand up or move away.  They are 'dancing', by way of her shaking her ass in his groin and he is grinding up against her. 

    When the song ends, she starts to complain that he had a hard on.  What the hell did she expect?!?  She did not move away when he came up behind her to 'dance' and she then continued to 'dance' in the same manner the rest of the evening.  

    Now, even though I found her behavior to be rather disgusting and her attitude as well, even though she put herself out there in such a way, no one should have assumed they could have sex with her unless she absolutely agreed.

    But the attention she got..........she brought on herself.  If she had not wanted that kind of attention she would have acted in a different manner.  

    Some people, regardless of male or female, want all the attention they can get, up to the point of sex.  This only tells me that person has some issues for seeking that type of attention but it, in no way, should be a determination of if they want, or should, be engaged in any sexual activity.

     

  • Ms.KitKat
    March 23, 2013 at 12:09 PM

     Even if a woman is drinking and drugging; I feel that is even MORE reason to back away!!!! It is quite obvious when a person is inebriated and therefore can not give consent. A person who has sex with an inebriated person is not obtaining consent and therefore it is forced (aka rape).

     

    Quoting PinkParadox:

    Drinking & drugs are certainly a separate issue, but the amount of skin shown is irrelevant. Period. Woman should be able to show as much skin as they want. Why? Because nakedness does not equal sex. Ever.

    Quoting jehosoba84:

     


    Quoting PinkParadox:

    So, at the end of the day, we are responsible for the action of men? Men are brainless beasts with no personal accountability? Men have no responsibility for themselves? Absolutely not. But the way women dress these days...Don't you see that you're inviting the wrong kind of attention? And don't women have any sort of self-preservation, getting drunk/high/etc with people they don't know? Where is their sense of personal responsiblity? No, it does not mean that they 'deserve' it. But they are asking for it. I speak from personal experience in this matter.

    I personally think everyone should walk around naked, because this would be a non issue.

    People will jump down my throat, but I blame organized religion for most of our current society issues.



    Quoting jehosoba84:


     Maybe my thinking is a product of the society I live in.   But if I go out, dressed like a skank, get drunk among strangers.... I really shouldn't be surprised if I get taken advantage of. By that.. I don't mean forcible rape. I mean he's drunk, and I'm drunk. Things happen that I didn't want to happen. According to law, that is rape.   



     In my opinion, a woman can dress very classy/sexy without baring breasts and wearing mini skirts. That kind of clothing send a very clear message. Men are visually oriented, we all know this. So why do we as women dress the way we do (leaving nothing to the imagination) and then act all surprised when we get 'unwanted' attention from it?


     

     

  • GrannyM.
    March 23, 2013 at 12:09 PM

    My Grandmother used to say..."If it's not for sale stop advertising it"....God Bless Her Wise Words...

  • jehosoba84
    March 23, 2013 at 12:10 PM

     

    Quoting FromAtoZ:


    Quoting jehosoba84:

     

    Quoting PinkParadox:

    So, at the end of the day, we are responsible for the action of men? Men are brainless beasts with no personal accountability? Men have no responsibility for themselves? Absolutely not. But the way women dress these days...Don't you see that you're inviting the wrong kind of attention? And don't women have any sort of self-preservation, getting drunk/high/etc with people they don't know? Where is their sense of personal responsiblity? No, it does not mean that they 'deserve' it. But they are asking for it. I speak from personal experience in this matter.

    I personally think everyone should walk around naked, because this would be a non issue.

    People will jump down my throat, but I blame organized religion for most of our current society issues.


    Quoting jehosoba84:

     Maybe my thinking is a product of the society I live in.   But if I go out, dressed like a skank, get drunk among strangers.... I really shouldn't be surprised if I get taken advantage of. By that.. I don't mean forcible rape. I mean he's drunk, and I'm drunk. Things happen that I didn't want to happen. According to law, that is rape.   


     In my opinion, a woman can dress very classy/sexy without baring breasts and wearing mini skirts. That kind of clothing send a very clear message. Men are visually oriented, we all know this. So why do we as women dress the way we do (leaving nothing to the imagination) and then act all surprised when we get 'unwanted' attention from it?

     

    Asking for attention...........yes, I can agree.  

    Asking to be raped........................no.

     I agree. I'm referring to the women who dress baring everything and drink/use drugs among strangers.  They are not usually in a state to say no, but throughout the evening they've been saying "Yes" with their bodies.   I'm not referring to forcible rape.

  • parentalrights1
    March 23, 2013 at 12:11 PM
    Why is it that other cultures that wear much less or even nothing have men that can control themselves better than ours that promotes body shame and expects everyone to be covered up?

    We set those standards as a society. It is not ingrained in the men. They are taught and enabled that they don't have to have self control because of the boys will be boys mentality


    Quoting jehosoba84: Maybe my thinking is a product of the society I live in.   But if I go out, dressed like a skank, get drunk among strangers.... I really shouldn't be surprised if I get taken advantage of. By that.. I don't mean forcible rape. I mean he's drunk, and I'm drunk. Things happen that I didn't want to happen. According to law, that is rape.   
     In my opinion, a woman can dress very classy/sexy without baring breasts and wearing mini skirts. That kind of clothing send a very clear message. Men are visually oriented, we all know this. So why do we as women dress the way we do (leaving nothing to the imagination) and then act all surprised when we get 'unwanted' attention from it?
  • mehamil1
    March 23, 2013 at 12:11 PM

    It's not about what a woman is wearing (or not wearing). There is no evidence to support that a woman is assaulted based on what she was wearing. Drunk, yes. But that's because rapists target women in vulnerable states knowing that if they get accused of rape charges will likely be dropped because his victim was drunk. These men, too many (not all) are predators and rely on rape culture to get away with what they are doing. A woman should be able to wear whatever she wants, get shit faced, and not have to worry about a predator raping her. 

    When I was assaulted, it was the middle of the day, outside my house, and I was wearing the oldest sweat pants and the shirt I had on was stained with food and dirt (I had been gardening in the front yard). Piss ass didn't give a shit. He assaulted me anyway. I fought him off. To many women are not so lucky. 

    We should be surprised if some jackass rapes a drunk woman. What kind of person does that? What kind of scum of the earth piece of shit human being rapes another human being in a vulnerable state? We should always be surprised and we should always put those pieces of human garbage in jail. 

    Quoting jehosoba84:

     Maybe my thinking is a product of the society I live in.   But if I go out, dressed like a skank, get drunk among strangers.... I really shouldn't be surprised if I get taken advantage of. By that.. I don't mean forcible rape. I mean he's drunk, and I'm drunk. Things happen that I didn't want to happen. According to law, that is rape.   

     In my opinion, a woman can dress very classy/sexy without baring breasts and wearing mini skirts. That kind of clothing send a very clear message. Men are visually oriented, we all know this. So why do we as women dress the way we do (leaving nothing to the imagination) and then act all surprised when we get 'unwanted' attention from it?

  • ReadWriteLuv
    March 23, 2013 at 12:12 PM

    Don't backpeddle. You said that anyone who dresses in that fashion is asking to be raped. So, if your friend in your instance had actually been raped, not danced with, by your line of thinking it would be her fault. 

    Quoting jehosoba84:

     

    Quoting FromAtoZ:


    Quoting jehosoba84:

     Maybe my thinking is a product of the society I live in.   But if I go out, dressed like a skank, get drunk among strangers.... I really shouldn't be surprised if I get taken advantage of. By that.. I don't mean forcible rape. I mean he's drunk, and I'm drunk. Things happen that I didn't want to happen. According to law, that is rape.   

     In my opinion, a woman can dress very classy/sexy without baring breasts and wearing mini skirts. That kind of clothing send a very clear message. Men are visually oriented, we all know this. So why do we as women dress the way we do (leaving nothing to the imagination) and then act all surprised when we get 'unwanted' attention from it?

    I understand what you are saying.  But no man should 'assume' any woman, regardless of her outfit or otherwise, is all for having sex.......unless she tells him so with her words and nothing else.  I'm really trying to explain my thoughts on this without making it seem like I'm just making excuses for men. But you say she must tell him so with words. Women are much more verbal than men. they are more visual creatures. In *his* mind she has already told him she would be open to sex by the way she dressed and acted. Can you really blame him to thinking so? So to me, it's not 'unless she tells him so with words' it's more like 'unless she tells him no with words.'   Did that make sense?

    Recently, I was out with a few people, different ages, the youngest being 21.  She was dancing with friends, by way of doing nothing more than bending over and shaking her ass.  All the while her boobs were hanging out of her top.

    Some guy comes up behind her, on the dance floor.  She does not stand up or move away.  They are 'dancing', by way of her shaking her ass in his groin and he is grinding up against her. 

    When the song ends, she starts to complain that he had a hard on.  What the hell did she expect?!?  She did not move away when he came up behind her to 'dance' and she then continued to 'dance' in the same manner the rest of the evening.  

    Now, even though I found her behavior to be rather disgusting and her attitude as well, even though she put herself out there in such a way, no one should have assumed they could have sex with her unless she absolutely agreed.

    But the attention she got..........she brought on herself.  If she had not wanted that kind of attention she would have acted in a different manner.  

    Some people, regardless of male or female, want all the attention they can get, up to the point of sex.  This only tells me that person has some issues for seeking that type of attention but it, in no way, should be a determination of if they want, or should, be engaged in any sexual activity.

     


  • stringtheory
    March 23, 2013 at 12:13 PM
    Why is it that a woman's appearance is seen as only relevant in terms of attracting appropriate or inappropriate attention from men? It only took two responses for the implication to be made that women should do whatever they do (dress, drink, dance, giggle) with potential male reactions in mind.
  • jehosoba84
    March 23, 2013 at 12:14 PM

     

    Quoting Ms.KitKat:

     Even if a woman is drinking and drugging; I feel that is even MORE reason to back away!!!! It is quite obvious when a person is inebriated and therefore can not give consent. If a girl has been kissing up on a guy(who may also be inebriated) and rubbing all over him all evening, to me, she has already told him yes. A person who has sex with an inebriated person is not obtaining consent and therefore it is forced (aka rape).

     

    Quoting PinkParadox:

    Drinking & drugs are certainly a separate issue, but the amount of skin shown is irrelevant. Period. Woman should be able to show as much skin as they want. Why? Because nakedness does not equal sex. Ever.

    It invites that kind of attention. Like granny said in above post, "If it's not for sale, stop advertising it." <--my new favorite quote.

    Quoting jehosoba84:

     


    Quoting PinkParadox:

    So, at the end of the day, we are responsible for the action of men? Men are brainless beasts with no personal accountability? Men have no responsibility for themselves? Absolutely not. But the way women dress these days...Don't you see that you're inviting the wrong kind of attention? And don't women have any sort of self-preservation, getting drunk/high/etc with people they don't know? Where is their sense of personal responsiblity? No, it does not mean that they 'deserve' it. But they are asking for it. I speak from personal experience in this matter.

    I personally think everyone should walk around naked, because this would be a non issue.

    People will jump down my throat, but I blame organized religion for most of our current society issues.



    Quoting jehosoba84:


     Maybe my thinking is a product of the society I live in.   But if I go out, dressed like a skank, get drunk among strangers.... I really shouldn't be surprised if I get taken advantage of. By that.. I don't mean forcible rape. I mean he's drunk, and I'm drunk. Things happen that I didn't want to happen. According to law, that is rape.   



     In my opinion, a woman can dress very classy/sexy without baring breasts and wearing mini skirts. That kind of clothing send a very clear message. Men are visually oriented, we all know this. So why do we as women dress the way we do (leaving nothing to the imagination) and then act all surprised when we get 'unwanted' attention from it?